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Panther's victory over us in the 03 NFCC is tainted...

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  • Panther's victory over us in the 03 NFCC is tainted...

    Looks like rampant steriod use was going on at the time, and that's cheating. Pure and simple.

    From pft...

    PANTHERS' 2003 NFC TITLE TAINTED?

    A exclusive report in the Charlotte Observer regarding steroid use during the team's 2003 run to the Super Bowl raises an obvious question, around which the hometown paper carefully tiptoes.

    Is the team's George Halas trophy tainted? Or were the Panthers players who were taking banned compounds merely keeping up with the Joneses in other NFL cities?

    Regardless, there was a real problem in 2003. Three of the five starting offensive linemen, tackle Todd Steussie, center Jeff Mitchell, and guard Jeff Donnalley, were receiving various prohibited substances from Dr. James Shortt, based on court documents obtained by the Observer in connection with the prosecution that resulted in Shortt being sent to jail for one year and one day.

    "Several of them were using disturbing, particularly alarmingly high amounts with high dosages for long durations -- some in combinations," said steroids expert Dr. Gary Wadler, who prepared a report for the proseuction in connection with the Shortt case. "This wasn't just a passing flirtation with these prohibited substances."

    And the inescapable conclusion reached after reading the Observer article is that the use of prohibited substances was indeed rampant and most likely brazen.

    So why weren't these guys caught? And in how many other cities have similar stories unfolded without detection?

    The Panthers' example is further proof that some players will do whatever is necessary to obtain and retain an edge against the competition on the other side of the line, and within the same locker room. It's also evidence that, even though the NFL generally has escaped public scrutiny for its steroids problem, the league still has a long way to go with respect to testing and enforcement.

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  • #2
    I really doubt that ANY team in the NFL is clean and the more that comes out I doubt that any SPORT is clean. It's just that these guys were caught.

    So, IMO, the victory is not tainted. Regardless, the Birds did not lose because of a bunch of beefed up offensive linemen. They lost because of a little guy named Ricky Manning and a cheap shot on #5.

    Comment


    • #3
      I thought it was tainted from the begining. The officals were TERRIBLE in that game. It was almost as tainted as the Steelers Super Bowl "win" last year.
      Were from Philly F in Philly no one likes us we DON'T CARE!

      Comment


      • #4
        Sure it could be tainted-------------------------give the media enough ammo and it will get that way.

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        • #5
          A shame the only guys they could implicate were the offensive linemen. Our D in that game was adequate enough to get us the victory. If they had implicated Manning Jr. or the guy who laid the cheap shot on McNabb at the beginning, I'd get some minor solace from it. Still, a loss is a loss. Especially one three years ago.

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          • #6
            We LOST. Period. No if's and or but's about it.

            Does it really matter now? Let's focus on the upcoming season.

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            • #7
              Goddamnit, I know we lost, and there's no crying in football, and yada yada.

              But, it's still cheating, and it pizzes me off.

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              • #8
                SI once asked about 300 world-class athletes, "If you could take a performance-enhancing drug that would guarantee you victory, but in ten years you would die...and you would never be caught, you would always be seen as the fair champion...would you take it?"

                About 295 of them said yes. After reading something like that, I'm sorry to say, but I think that everyone at this level is on something, whether it bends the rules or breaks them. I hope that Ryan Howard isn't, and it'd be nice to see a Phillie with a 50-HR season, but who knows? It's tough anymore, to see these players without wondering that sort of thing.

                Even if these drugs were legal and they established a limit on how many steroids you could take, there would be rule-breakers who would take "just a little more." I hear that gene therapies may be next (seriously), we'll end up with guys like the Incredible Hulk.
                "Philly fans are great....It's the only place where you pull up on the bus and you've got the grandfather, the grandmother, the kids and the grandkids - everybody flicking you off. At other stadiums, they give you the thumbs-down. Here, they give you the middle finger.”
                — Michael Strahan

                "No one likes us, no one likes us, no one likes us, we don’t care, we’re from Philly, F—-ing Philly, No one likes us, we don’t care!”
                - Jason Kelce with the best championship speech ever

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                • #9
                  that could not be the difference maker in that game...you would have to prove the eagles players were drug free...then presume that the patriots were even more juiced than the panthers.

                  accept it...it is pro sports these days. when millions are on the line you have to do everything possible to excell.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by bird is da word
                    accept it...it is pro sports these days. when millions are on the line you have to do everything possible to excell.
                    Bird - I understand you are simply stating the prevailing attitude so understand I'm addressing the attitude and not flaming you personally.

                    There are Billions to be had in heroin trafficking, I guess that makes it ok?
                    That's a crock of shit. First off, it's cheating. I rate cheats just barely above child molesters. Second, these are illegal drugs. There is no difference between these guys and the LT's and Strawberry's of the world. Stick a needle in your arm - doesn't matter if it's steroids or heroin - it's the same thing. It burns me that these same guys doing public service announcements to discourage kids from using drugs. Then we have to stomach "supposedly" decent guys like Schilling etc.. stand in front of congress and pretend they know nothing about steroid use in baseball because they don't want to be seen as a "rat". Like they have some delusion that somehow there's "honor" in keeping quiet about illegal drug use? Think they teach their kids that? "No, Johnny, you should never tell me if Jimmy is selling crack"

                    Look, I've done my share of things in the past that I'd rather my kids not find out about and what an adult chooses to do in the privacy (or what's left of it) of his own house is their own business as long as it doesn't effect others. Well, steroid use does effect others. It diminishes the integrity of the game -see this thread and it calls into question the accomplishments of all athletes whether they are clean or dirty.

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                    • #11
                      I agree that our D played well enough to win that game. Bottom line is we scored 3 points - period - in the NFCCG at home. You'll never win a big game scoring 3 points.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by bay_bird
                        I agree that our D played well enough to win that game. Bottom line is we scored 3 points - period - in the NFCCG at home. You'll never win a big game scoring 3 points.
                        How can you say that. Didn't Dawk, even by his own admission at the time, call it the worst game he ever played. Remember the TD he gave away in the end zone with his horribly timed jump. The only comparable monumental miserable snafu of recent years would be Litoschmuck's endzone coverage the following year. Then there was the little example of our lousy LB coverage on THE play that broke our backs.

                        On the other hand we tried but we only had one known roid user on our side at the time....Welbourn.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Pagstx
                          I really doubt that ANY team in the NFL is clean and the more that comes out I doubt that any SPORT is clean. It's just that these guys were caught.

                          So, IMO, the victory is not tainted. Regardless, the Birds did not lose because of a bunch of beefed up offensive linemen. They lost because of a little guy named Ricky Manning and a cheap shot on #5.
                          That wasn't a cheap shot. It certainly APPEARED like a cheap shot when it happened, but the fact that no one likes to remember is that what we didn't know until after the game was that the whistle never blew. The ref didn't think McNabb had been touched yet when he was on the ground, and that's when he got slammed and hurt his ribs. Even McNabb has never disputed that's what happened.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            [quote=Flying Dutchman]
                            Originally posted by "bay_bird":a1ffa
                            I agree that our D played well enough to win that game. Bottom line is we scored 3 points - period - in the NFCCG at home. You'll never win a big game scoring 3 points.
                            How can you say that. Didn't Dawk, even by his own admission at the time, call it the worst game he ever played. Remember the TD he gave away in the end zone with his horribly timed jump. The only comparable monumental miserable snafu of recent years would be Litoschmuck's endzone coverage the following year. Then there was the little example of our lousy LB coverage on THE play that broke our backs.

                            On the other hand we tried but we only had one known roid user on our side at the time....Welbourn.[/quote:a1ffa]

                            If memory serves, didn't they give up 14 points? That Eagles offense was certainly capable of scoring more than 14 points on an average day. They just so happened to have a below average day. If I told you that morning that the D would give up 14 points, wouldn't you have assumed we would have won the game?

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                            • #15
                              I looked it up to check my memory: they did give up 14 to the Panthers (14-3) - I should remember the score, it was a long flight back home to SF after watching that debacle.

                              The Eagles scored less than 14 points just twice that season - the two horrible games to open the Linc. They should have scored at least 17 to win that game. No question.

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