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  • Most overrated QB in football-I'm with number 5

    Is Carson Wentz still a top 10 quarterback?
    20
    The simple answer is... yes.
    By John Stolnis@JohnStolnis May 11, 2019, 9:11am EDT
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    Matthew Emmons-USA TODAY Sports
    Some people tend to have short memories.

    For 13 games of the 2017 season, there was not a single quarterback in the NFL who was playing better than Carson Wentz. He was the presumed league MVP and, even if some of his red zone and 3rd down numbers weren’t sustainable long-term, it was clear Wentz had become one of the most dynamic and winning quarterbacks in football.

    Then, the knee injury happened. Nick Foles came in and won a Super Bowl. Wentz returned in Week 3 of last year and, although he put up decent numbers, the team didn’t win and he clearly wasn’t the playmaker he was the year before. We also learned he suffered a back fracture during the season and, ultimately, that injury forced him to miss the last three games of the season for the second year in a row.

    So yes, Carson Wentz is under some pressure as the summer of 2019 approaches and there are some questions about his ability to stay healthy. And although the majority of the fanbase still loves Wentz, their belief in him is nowhere near as robust as when he was dominating the league two years ago.

    So given all that happened last season and the uncertainty of what we’ll see from Wentz in 2019, it’s fair to revisit where he is in the pecking order of QBs. Is he still a top-10 signal caller?

    Pro Football Focus would have you believe he isn’t, but here’s my list of the 10 best QBs in football heading into 2019.

    1. Patrick Mahomes - Kansas City Chiefs

    Mahomes is the reigning MVP and his 113.8 passer rating, 50/12 TD/INT ratio, 8.79 yards per attempt (Y/A), 46 big-time throws (a PFF stat, which led the league) and ability to make the incredible plays look simple, has him on top of my list. The sky’s the limit, although it seems almost certain a slight regression should be expected. He’s not doing 50/12 again.

    2. Drew Brees - New Orleans Saints

    Brees finished with the best rating in football (115.7), and his 5 INTs were among the lowest in the league. He completed an incredible 74.4% of his passes all while averaging 9.01 air yards per attempt (AY/A) that was 2nd only to Mahomes. If you had him at No. 1, I couldn’t argue.


    3. Russell Wilson - Seattle Seahawks

    Wilson has emerged as the QB who is the hardest to kill on any given play in the league. He finished with the 3rd best rating (110.9) last season, threw 35 TDs to 7 INTs with a wide receiving corps that was led by the talented, if unspectacular, Tyler Lockett (57 catches for 965 yards, 10 TDs). He is terrifying.

    4. Philip Rivers - San Diego Chargers

    Rivers is still one of the elite passers in the game, and it’s a crime this guy has never made it to a Super Bowl. His 105.5 rating last year was 5th best in the NFL, his 8.68 AY/A was 7th, and he was ranked 4th overall by PFF as well. His 83.8 rating under pressure was 6th among qualified QBs.

    5. Andrew Luck - Indianapolis Colts

    Despite being ranked as PFF’s No. 3 QB last year, his 98.7 rating was just 10th best in the NFL, and his 15 INTs were the most of anyone else on this group. As PFF mentioned, he did pick up 59.9% of his passing yards through the air, 3rd most among qualified QBs, and he was 5th in the NFL in passing yards (4593) and 2nd in TDs (39).

    6. Tom Brady - New England Patriots

    There’s something to be said for QBs who know how to pull it all together in the big moment, and until he officially declines, Brady is still a top-10 QB. His 97.7 rating was only 11th-best, as was his 7.79 AY/A, he ranked 7th in passing yards (4355), and he threw a mere 29 TDs. However, it’s hard to bump him down any further than this, given he just won his 6th Super Bowl title and is usually a top-3 MVP candidate year after year.

    7. Aaron Rodgers - Green Bay Packers

    Does Rodgers make this list simply by reputation at this point? Sure, because he had the weight of Mike McCarthy around his neck all this time, and after that Bleacher Report article that came out a couple weeks ago, a vengeful Rodgers could make him even better this year. But after an injury-plagued 2017 season, he had just 25 TDs last year (with only 2 INTs, it should be noted), and was sacked 49 times last year, 5th most in the NFL. He’s still got the capability of being really good, but how often does Rodgers win the big playoff game anymore?

    8. DeShaun Watson - Houston Texans

    What Watson did behind one of the worst offensive lines in football last year was nothing short of spectacular. PFF graded him as the No. 11 QB, but the fact his was pressured in more dropbacks and still led the NFL is passer rating under pressure (according to PFF, 88.2), speaks volumes. Despite those headwinds, he ranked 7th in AY/A (8.4 and 6th in interception percentage. Not only that, he’s a playmaker who rushed for 551 yards and 5 TDs last year.

    9. Carson Wentz - Philadelphia Eagles

    This felt like the right place to put Wentz. Even in a year in which he was coming back from a terrible knee injury and suffered a back fracture midway through the season, Wentz still finished with the 7th best QB Rating (102.2), was 9th in yards per game (279.5), 3rd in completion percentage (69.6%), and 9th in AY/A (7.93). PFF graded Wentz as the 13th best QB in football last year, one spot ahead of Kirk Cousins and one spot below Andy Dalton, thanks to lackluster big-time throw percentage and turnover-worthy throw percentage numbers. But it’s fair to think he’ll be a top-10 guy in 2019 if he’s fully healthy, which is certainly a fair concern.

    10. Matt Ryan - Atlanta Falcons

    It’ll be fascinating to see what Ryan can do now that Steve Sarkasian is gone. Dirk Koetter has taken over as Atlanta’s offensive coordinator, and there’s no doubt Ryan has a lot of talent to work with. Last year, PFF ranked him 10th overall, even though he had the 4th-best passer rating (108.1), had a 35/7 TD/INT ratio, was 3rd in yards passing (4924), and was 5th in AY/A. That he failed to make the postseason wasn’t really his fault, but Ryan’s failure to win big games (especially the last two seasons) knocks him down this list.

    Just missed: Jared Goff, Ben Roethlisberger, Baker Mayfield

    Is Wentz at No. 9 fair? If you’re still not sure, just remember what he did two seasons ago. Don’t forget he was the MVP of the entire league before he got hurt.


    Because this is the player Wentz is and he’s proven that, when healthy, he’s more than a top-10 QB in the league.

    He’s an MVP.


    IMO. Wentz is better than Watson and Luck is lucky to make the list. He's a turnover machine in many games. I think that the only thing that Carson has to do is hang onto the ball better and he easily blows by Watson and Luck is out of luck.
    "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

  • #2
    "Is Wentz at No. 9 fair? If you’re still not sure, just remember what he did two seasons ago. Don’t forget he was the MVP of the entire league before he got hurt.


    Because this is the player Wentz is and he’s proven that, when healthy, he’s more than a top-10 QB in the league."

    Have to disagree here--- the key is this "before he got hurt." and "Because this is the player Wentz is and he’s proven that, when healthy"

    You can not just ignore that fact and make them be something that hasn't been proven yet. I love the guy, has great upside, could be HOF stuff..... but he has to prove it not just be awarded it. Frankly, 9th might be a tad high, just saying.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by MDFAN View Post
      "Is Wentz at No. 9 fair? If you’re still not sure, just remember what he did two seasons ago. Don’t forget he was the MVP of the entire league before he got hurt.


      Because this is the player Wentz is and he’s proven that, when healthy, he’s more than a top-10 QB in the league."

      Have to disagree here--- the key is this "before he got hurt." and "Because this is the player Wentz is and he’s proven that, when healthy"

      You can not just ignore that fact and make them be something that hasn't been proven yet. I love the guy, has great upside, could be HOF stuff..... but he has to prove it not just be awarded it. Frankly, 9th might be a tad high, just saying.
      I'm not sure you really believe that MD as you have repeatedly posted that "you have to protect the franchise" and your roster would include 25 offensive lineman protecting him if you were GM LOL!!
      "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Eagle60 View Post
        I'm not sure you really believe that MD as you have repeatedly posted that "you have to protect the franchise" and your roster would include 25 offensive linemen protecting him if you were GM LOL!!
        Exactly-- he is the franchise, he needs to be protected--- BUT--- he has not proved that he can stay on the field. Let's remember the question-- is he an elite (top 10 QB and is 9 fair) QB. Is his back going to be a chronic thing? Will his knee come back to bite him later on?

        Just cause he is "our" franchise player--- doesn't get him ranked any higher until he proves it, IMM.

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        • #5
          The questions really is what does injury prone really mean? Obviously everyones body is different and things like bone density help determine if a bone breaks or just bruises. But for soft tissue injuries is there a comparable measurement that helps determine if ligament or tendon will tear? Can stretching and yoga prevent another ACL tear or are some peoples tissue simply more prone to rupture? History makes me think that some people are actually more susceptible to injuries but modern sports science makes me think Doctors and Trainers can create a program to offset that susceptibility through strengthening and conditioning. When you include improvements in protective equipment that is now available I just don’t think anyone could be considered injury prone unless they refuse to follow the program. The exception would be multiple injuries to the same body part. If Carson tears the same ACL in the same area then the scar tissue will absolutely impact him in the future. But unrelated injuries like an ACL tear and bone fracture don’t make him injury prone IMM.
          Official Driver of the Eagles Bandwagon!!!
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          • #6
            Juken, nobody used the word "injury" prone--- All I said was he has to prove (to me at least) that he CAN stay on the field and perform at that high of a level. The reason he hasn't yet, for the purposes of that list, IMM, just doesn't make a difference. He has questions about him.

            Will this back problem (his second) cause him problems down the road (hell, he hasn't even come back from this one yet and we still don't know if this last one has had any impact). He has won exactly 0 playoff games, how does he play under that kind of pressure? (we don't know, maybe great or maybe poorly), he has got to prove it, IMM

            I am not saying he is injury prone--- just saying that we still have to see how he comes back from these things.

            Comment


            • #7
              I understand the concern MD but look how much time Aaron Rodgers has missed over the years. Watson missed a year after only about 3 games and even Brady missed a year. Wentz played half of the season with a broken back. I agree that backs are different cases though and I'd hate to see him go down the Tony Romo path. I think that I would give him another year too but he did suffer some hellacious hits last season but they all do. The damn position is almost a suicide place to play other than those wrs who go across the middle and are at the mercy of dbs. It's a brutal sport isn't it?
              "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Eagle60 View Post
                I understand the concern MD but look how much time Aaron Rodgers has missed over the years. Watson missed a year after only about 3 games and even Brady missed a year. Wentz played half of the season with a broken back. I agree that backs are different cases though and I'd hate to see him go down the Tony Romo path. I think that I would give him another year too but he did suffer some hellacious hits last season but they all do. The damn position is almost a suicide place to play other than those wrs who go across the middle and are at the mercy of dbs. It's a brutal sport isn't it?
                Yes and I do appreciate your answer---BUT--- that does not address the original question. Yes, Rodgers has missed time, but he also has a long history of being very good. Same with Brady. I also disagree on Watson, hasn't proved it to me yet.

                Again I am not saying he can't be number 1 or 2 or 3 on that list--- but he does not have the credentials to be there now.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by MDFAN View Post
                  Yes and I do appreciate your answer---BUT--- that does not address the original question. Yes, Rodgers has missed time, but he also has a long history of being very good. Same with Brady. I also disagree on Watson, hasn't proved it to me yet.

                  Again I am not saying he can't be number 1 or 2 or 3 on that list--- but he does not have the credentials to be there now.


                  Deal!! I'm kind of wondering if Mahomes is going to keep the magic up too. That no look pass is going to get picked off one of these days and man does he have weapons!
                  "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I think the jury is still out at this point. The guy did have a great season going before he got hurt. But, he did get hurt, and he wasn't quite the same player last season before getting hurt again. You can't overlook that. Some guys simply cannot stay healthy. And, some guys never seem to get hurt. There's no way to quantify it. You have a guy like Carson who is big, strong, and can run like a dear, and so far he's spent a lot of time on the shelf, and then you've got a guy like Eli, and he never gets hurt.

                    It is THE issue with Wentz. It really doesn't matter if he's a top 10, or a top 5, or if he's the best QB in the league if he's wearing a ball cap, watching from the sidelines. As of right now, I can't rate him a top 10 QB, because he's simply missed too many games. I don't know, at this point, if they can count on him. His back is still not right. And, we're not talking about a guy that got dinged and missed a couple of games. He's had season ending injuries in 2 of the last 3 seasons. Even Afred E Newman should be worried about that.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Eaglebreath View Post
                      I think the jury is still out at this point. The guy did have a great season going before he got hurt. But, he did get hurt, and he wasn't quite the same player last season before getting hurt again. You can't overlook that. Some guys simply cannot stay healthy. And, some guys never seem to get hurt. There's no way to quantify it. You have a guy like Carson who is big, strong, and can run like a dear, and so far he's spent a lot of time on the shelf, and then you've got a guy like Eli, and he never gets hurt.

                      It is THE issue with Wentz. It really doesn't matter if he's a top 10, or a top 5, or if he's the best QB in the league if he's wearing a ball cap, watching from the sidelines. As of right now, I can't rate him a top 10 QB, because he's simply missed too many games. I don't know, at this point, if they can count on him. His back is still not right. And, we're not talking about a guy that got dinged and missed a couple of games. He's had season ending injuries in 2 of the last 3 seasons. Even Afred E Newman should be worried about that.
                      He played pretty darned good last year with that injury. For some reason the team rallies around Foles. It was the defense more than the offense that helped in the run and I think that Jernigan helped as much or more with his comeback. All you can do is roll the dice with him and protect him better because that injury was due to the pounding that he took, not the running part of his game. Being 6'5" tall and lanky has it's disadvantages too unfortunately. Hey, if he gets hurt you start over again. You'll only be stuck with the contract for a year or 2 anyway. As far as drafting goes you are right but you need to do a better job of that anyway. The years he's healthy we'll be right in it, the years he's not we're porked. Just maybe he saves us some $millions but I doubt it. He also missed a year in college. Hell yeah I'm worried but you certainly don't trade a talent like him away like we talked before!
                      "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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                      • #12
                        There is a difference between top ten best QBs in the league and the top ten most talented QBs in the league. There is little doubt IMM that he is top ten most talented in the league. Top ten best????? have to say the jury is still out so I don't think he can be called best.
                        Wait until next year is a terrible philosophy
                        Hope is not a strategy
                        RIP

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Eagle60 View Post
                          He played pretty darned good last year with that injury.
                          True, but he wasn't the same player he was the year before. He wasn't playing like the MVP of the league, and he was missing a lot of throws that he made the year before. He looked off at times. I'm pretty sure it was injury related, but he needs to get back to playing like he did before the knee. If he does that, he could very well be one of the best in the league.

                          Just keep your fingers crossed.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Eaglebreath View Post
                            True, but he wasn't the same player he was the year before. He wasn't playing like the MVP of the league, and he was missing a lot of throws that he made the year before. He looked off at times. I'm pretty sure it was injury related, but he needs to get back to playing like he did before the knee. If he does that, he could very well be one of the best in the league.

                            Just keep your fingers crossed.
                            Of course he didn't look the same EB, he had a broken back LOL!!! I hear what you're saying though. The knee should be OK I would think but it's the back that I'm worried about.
                            "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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