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49ers Hire Chip Kelly

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  • #16
    We're looking for people that are fundamentally different,” vice president of player personnel Andy Weidl said Saturday night. “The love and passion for football, it's non-negotiable. They're caring, their character, they do the right thing persistently, and they have a relentless playing style that you can see on tape. The motor, it burns hot. You see them finishing plays. They have a team-first mentality. They're selfless individuals.

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    • #17
      The look on his face says 'why do I have to stand hear and listen to you'. I don't think Kelly is a bad coach. I really believe the friction in the FO and the moving up to be in charge of everything killed him.
      Wait until next year is a terrible philosophy
      Hope is not a strategy
      RIP

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      • #18
        Originally posted by NoDakIggle` View Post
        The look on his face says 'why do I have to stand hear and listen to you'. I don't think Kelly is a bad coach. I really believe the friction in the FO and the moving up to be in charge of everything killed him.
        I think he was an inexplicably bad coach this year... much better the previous two years. I think, this season at least, he failed more as a coach than GM. He made mistakes in the personnel for sure, but... he seemed to simplify the offense more than past years and it was far less effective than it had been, and it seemed like he had no answers to fix it (or maybe they involved things like slowing the tempo to the point that the offense could get their minds clear, or audible sometimes, and he just couldn't accept doing that since the tempo is his calling card, and that sort of thing).

        He could well rebound in future years -- he did show a lot of real talent I thought. But something about the whole situation this year overwhelmed him, and it may have cost him too many interpersonal relationships to fix.

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        • #19
          I think what Kelly experienced this year was the NFL defensive adjustments to his offense. I think he was in way over his head trying to handle player personnel decisions after having not been in the NFL. At least when Saban had been a defensive coordinator for four years in Cleveland before he went to college when went to the Dolphins. But evaluating free agents is whole different ball game. Like I said, the Eagles were his NFL training ground.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by WCPhan View Post
            I think what Kelly experienced this year was the NFL defensive adjustments to his offense. I think he was in way over his head trying to handle player personnel decisions after having not been in the NFL. At least when Saban had been a defensive coordinator for four years in Cleveland before he went to college when went to the Dolphins. But evaluating free agents is whole different ball game. Like I said, the Eagles were his NFL training ground.


            Like Reggie White?
            "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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            • #21
              "I think he was an inexplicably bad coach this year"
              But is he an inexplicably bad coach or was he bad this year because of all the other stuff surrounding this year? See I feel all the other stuff negatively impacted his coaching ability. He has never been a warm and fuzzy guy but he got along with players for the most part. This year he had far less time for players and sent an underling to deal with them--what kind of crap is that for a coach. I felt the same with Andy.
              Coaches infamously put in hours upon hours watching film, game planning, looking at potentials FAs or draft picks, etc.
              GMs also put in hours upon hours. When you combine the jobs something has to suffer. If you have a great OC/DC/ST C then maybe it works a little. If they are average then it doesn't work IMM.
              Wait until next year is a terrible philosophy
              Hope is not a strategy
              RIP

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              • #22
                Originally posted by NoDakIggle` View Post
                "I think he was an inexplicably bad coach this year"
                But is he an inexplicably bad coach or was he bad this year because of all the other stuff surrounding this year? See I feel all the other stuff negatively impacted his coaching ability. He has never been a warm and fuzzy guy but he got along with players for the most part. This year he had far less time for players and sent an underling to deal with them--what kind of crap is that for a coach. I felt the same with Andy.
                Coaches infamously put in hours upon hours watching film, game planning, looking at potentials FAs or draft picks, etc.
                GMs also put in hours upon hours. When you combine the jobs something has to suffer. If you have a great OC/DC/ST C then maybe it works a little. If they are average then it doesn't work IMM.
                Yeah... it sounds like it was more something which happened this year. There isn't as much to do as GM during the season (and Marynowitz would have handled most of it), but it had to affect the off-season. And it might have caused Kelly to have a different outlook on relationships with players, maybe without realizing it.

                The playbook was very much simplified -- maybe to protect Bradford -- but Kelly seemed helpless to fix it. Or not willing to give up his signature traits, like tempo. Even given all the extra plays, the offense scored roughly league average number of points per game. But if you're going to expose your defense that much, you better be scoring well above average on offense. We weren't, and Kelly never tried much of anything different -- and when he did, it was too little to late.

                Caplan had some interesting quotes here:
                http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2...nse-west-coast

                "You’re going to see sports science, that’s going to stay. Their own version of it. I think they know that the sports science plan has got to be altered. The way they implement it with Doug. Doug’s certainly on board with it. There’s value to sports science. More teams are using it. The buy -in really went away with Chip under his last year. Players didn’t like the way it was administered. I kind of hinted at that a little bit before, I’ll go a little bit more in depth. The problem that we saw under Chip Kelly and sports science … the players would get their assignments during the week from everyone but Chip."
                [...]

                Chip distanced himself from the players way too much. Doug is going to be a guy that will tell the players what they need to know. You have no idea how much that will get respect from the players. Chip lost his way in a big way this season. More than anyone understands. I will tell you this: Doug won’t do that. And Chip just … he was an issue skirter. He tried to skirt blame. As we all know. That’s one of the most damning things about Chip this season. That will not happen with Doug Pederson. Of course, he works for Andy Reid, as you know, Andy never deflects blame. He takes it. Like a man. I think people are really going to like Doug. A good man, a good coach. But again, you’re not going to know if this guy can handle the job for several months.
                If Kelly was skirting blame like we saw at the press conference, especially internally, that is a bad situation. If you are going to demand the authority, then you better take the responsibility.

                Maybe it was that he didn't respect Roseman from day 1 -- I imagine bringing in Tom Gamble was a requirement for joining the Eagles. If he automatically discounted Roseman just because of his past, and not his track record, I could see that being ugly. And that relationship probably just got worse over time. If Kelly respects Baalke... he might be able to just be a coach there. But it will be interesting to see if he can fix some of the mistakes he made here.

                I think a lot of his approach has merit. I'm still unsure on the all-the-time tempo. I'm sort of hoping he succeeds, just for the variety of it all, but if he succeeds incredibly well it will be rather bittersweet (unless the Eagles succeed just as well, and earlier).

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                • #23
                  I'm sorry, but no football coach in the NFL is going to respect a non football guy. What coach is going to respect what the Ferret has to say? As long as Lurie insists on having on having him around there sre going to be problems.
                  "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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                  • #24
                    Mangini might be the Niners DC

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Eagle60 View Post
                      I'm sorry, but no football coach in the NFL is going to respect a non football guy. What coach is going to respect what the Ferret has to say? As long as Lurie insists on having on having him around there sre going to be problems.
                      60 you have to stop with the whole "Howie is a non-football guy" thing. I love you bud, but you just aren't being fair here. I'm not a big Howie Roseman fan, but I find it hard to really criticize him too much since we simply don't know what he is responsible for and what others wanted. The fact that he wasn't a player is meaningless - Chip Kelly never played either. He has coached on several levels but never stepped on the field. Roseman has been in the NFL for over 15 years with almost half that time as a high ranking member of the FO. Chip has coached for 25 years but didn't become a HC until 2009 just 1 year before Howie became a GM. Chip has never run an organization at the level Roseman has and his 1 foray into that world was an abysmal failure. Howie can't draw up a game an or figure out how to defend against Brady, but no one is asking him to do that. He's working with a group that includes the coaches, to bring in the best players for the team. According to Lurie, he does that well. If a player or a ccoach thinks he needs to have played the game to do that, then fuck them, I don't want that guy on my team. Not all coaches have played. To assume the GM has to have played is crazy IMO.
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                      • #26
                        I'm not sure any player would respect a ball boy....ooops. j/k 60 I understand where you are coming from but I think it has more to do with being good at what you do. I think there are two baseball GMs that have never played the game but are successful GMs. If you sit in a box and call the coach or manager and make suggestions about how the game is going you are a pos; if you do your job and let them do theirs you will probably be okay
                        Wait until next year is a terrible philosophy
                        Hope is not a strategy
                        RIP

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Jukin View Post
                          60 you have to stop with the whole "Howie is a non-football guy" thing. I love you bud, but you just aren't being fair here. I'm not a big Howie Roseman fan, but I find it hard to really criticize him too much since we simply don't know what he is responsible for and what others wanted. The fact that he wasn't a player is meaningless - Chip Kelly never played either. He has coached on several levels but never stepped on the field. Roseman has been in the NFL for over 15 years with almost half that time as a high ranking member of the FO. Chip has coached for 25 years but didn't become a HC until 2009 just 1 year before Howie became a GM. Chip has never run an organization at the level Roseman has and his 1 foray into that world was an abysmal failure. Howie can't draw up a game an or figure out how to defend against Brady, but no one is asking him to do that. He's working with a group that includes the coaches, to bring in the best players for the team. According to Lurie, he does that well. If a player or a ccoach thinks he needs to have played the game to do that, then fuck them, I don't want that guy on my team. Not all coaches have played. To assume the GM has to have played is crazy IMO.
                          Juk, of course Chip had an athletic background:

                          Charles Kelly was born in Dover, New Hampshire. He attended Manchester Central High School[1] and earned his Bachelor of Science in physical education from the University of New Hampshire in 1990.[2] He played quarterback at Manchester Central and defensive back at the University of New Hampshire.[3] Additionally, he played ice hockey and basketball during his high school years.[4]
                          "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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                          • #28
                            It's just a matter of putting the right staff around him. Howies should be counting beans. He should appoint a man who is a great judge of horseflesh to handle player evaluations and selections, and keep his mouth out of it. Howie cuood be a terific FO guy, or GM. Just build a good team and DON'T FIGHT WITH THEM.
                            http://shop.cafepress.com/content/global/img/spacer.gifOK, let's try this again...

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                            • #29
                              I think by football guy, it's not so much if you played the game itself, but how you came up through the ranks. I'd have a lot more confidence in someone from the scouting side of it. Someone who has a history of scouting players, worked as a scout, or with scouts. Someone who understands player evaluation. As opposed to someone who came up on the financial side of things, and decides that he wants to get involved in personnel. The bottom line is that someone has to be responsible for making the call on who gets put on the roster. If that person is right more often than not, you're probably going to end up with a talented team. If not, you do shit like drafting LJ Smith instead of Jason Witten, and it really doesn't matter who the coach is, because they're being set up for failure.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Eaglebreath View Post
                                I think by football guy, it's not so much if you played the game itself, but how you came up through the ranks. I'd have a lot more confidence in someone from the scouting side of it. Someone who has a history of scouting players, worked as a scout, or with scouts. Someone who understands player evaluation. As opposed to someone who came up on the financial side of things, and decides that he wants to get involved in personnel. The bottom line is that someone has to be responsible for making the call on who gets put on the roster. If that person is right more often than not, you're probably going to end up with a talented team. If not, you do shit like drafting LJ Smith instead of Jason Witten, and it really doesn't matter who the coach is, because they're being set up for failure.
                                I agree EB, and I hate the fact that Howie is learning on my dime. The thing that really irks me is that Lurie knows this. He has openly come out and said that he stays out of the way and lets "the football people make those kinds of decisions". But somehow he decided that Banner and Howie were "football people".

                                Well the decision is history now and there's nothing any of us can do about it. It would be comforting to know that our organization is headed in the right direction but I have very little faith in that with the present administration. I do like the selection of Doug as HC, but that's just a hunch. I'd like to see a SB before I cash in my chips. I'd like to see World Peace too. I guess I had to settle on Niagara Falls, but man that really was something! I still watch my videos everyday!
                                "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

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