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I'd start McDougle and other DL thoughts

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  • I'd start McDougle and other DL thoughts

    I like Cole as a RDE. He's real comfortable there, so why mess with a good thing?

    Freak played LDE, so your option is to: (1) Flop Howard to LDE from RDE, (2) play Juqua Thomas as starting LDE, (3) flop Cole and make him play LDE, (4) start McDougle at LDE.

    Best option IMO is McDougle. here's why. The LDE plays against right tackles of the O. The ROT's are the power players, the big bodies (ex. Runyan). Freak was unusual in that he played run pretty well against the big biys, but really his speed paid off in pass situations running around these behemoth RT's who usually play power DE's not speed guys. Usually the speed rushers are your RDE's-like Freeney.

    McDougle IS a good run defender. He is a good fit at LDE, and was a sub there in the past. Thomas is way too small and would get worn down at LDE. I also hate to take Cole out of his zone. Howard could easily flop sides, but he anchors the WEAK SIDE of the D. He is strong and good at fighting off the seal on the backsie of the play. he was KEY in bottling up Tiki's cutbacks, because he powered the LOT and maintained good postion. This lets McCoy fly around. If McCoy plays well, he should thank the unsung Howard for making his job easier and keeping him clena and allowing him to flow to the ball. WIP morons who bash Howard for no sacks are not watching him contain Tiki. Whatever.

    McDougle can play. I like the explosion off the ball Im saw before he got the rib injury. His sack against Cleveland showed he still has the burst. he has plenty of speed and will cause RT's problems just like Jevon. He just can't stand up and rush and get moved around and play Joker like JK. But he will get sacks and pressure and we shouldn't miss a beat.

    People forget that our baby DT's will get better as the seaon goes on. So the dropoff from losing JK will be balanced by the improvement of Bunkley, Patterson, ect. Walker also looks strong and should benefit from the rotation-he's still a real nice inside rush DT.

    Finally, the wildcard is Ramsey. This kid is so athliteic you could play him at LDE on certain run downs. He is a stud IMO. I love this kid's potential-he's more athletic than even Bunkley or Patterson in terms of how he moves!

    So I see a loss of flexibility in terms of the packages JJ can run, but no steep drop off in pressure with a Howard, Cole, McDougle, Thomas rotation at DE. If it was me, I'd think about using Trotter in the Joker role in the nickle, as he is strong enough to take on the OL and still quick enough to make a few plays. Not ideal, but you want Barber in coverage. Don't laugh, but Ramsey runs well enough to maybe play some of the standup rush stuff. You heard it here first if it happens. My best guess is they would use Jason Short at Joker--he got time at DE this summer, and he moves well for a 260 lbs guy.

  • #2
    Great post as usual JRJ.

    Let me add to it, the Mike Patterson effect. The guys is playing way out of his mind so far. He's getting deep penetration, sacks, and there's absolutely no way you can stop him singlehandedly. He's just too fast.
    "You will dress only in attire specially sanctioned by P.E. special services… You are no longer part of the system. You are above the system, over it, beyond it. We're "them." We're "they." We are the Men in Green."

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    • #3
      Sounds good JRJ, then after McDougle gets hurt in the 2nd quarter of the 49er game, Juqua can step in.

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      • #4
        Re: I'd start McDougle and other DL thoughts

        Originally posted by JRJ
        I like Cole as a RDE. He's real comfortable there, so why mess with a good thing?

        Freak played LDE, so your option is to: (1) Flop Howard to LDE from RDE, (2) play Juqua Thomas as starting LDE, (3) flop Cole and make him play LDE, (4) start McDougle at LDE.

        Best option IMO is McDougle. here's why. The LDE plays against right tackles of the O. The ROT's are the power players, the big bodies (ex. Runyan). Freak was unusual in that he played run pretty well against the big biys, but really his speed paid off in pass situations running around these behemoth RT's who usually play power DE's not speed guys. Usually the speed rushers are your RDE's-like Freeney.

        McDougle IS a good run defender. He is a good fit at LDE, and was a sub there in the past. Thomas is way too small and would get worn down at LDE. I also hate to take Cole out of his zone. Howard could easily flop sides, but he anchors the WEAK SIDE of the D. He is strong and good at fighting off the seal on the backsie of the play. he was KEY in bottling up Tiki's cutbacks, because he powered the LOT and maintained good postion. This lets McCoy fly around. If McCoy plays well, he should thank the unsung Howard for making his job easier and keeping him clena and allowing him to flow to the ball. WIP morons who bash Howard for no sacks are not watching him contain Tiki. Whatever.

        McDougle can play. I like the explosion off the ball Im saw before he got the rib injury. His sack against Cleveland showed he still has the burst. he has plenty of speed and will cause RT's problems just like Jevon. He just can't stand up and rush and get moved around and play Joker like JK. But he will get sacks and pressure and we shouldn't miss a beat.

        People forget that our baby DT's will get better as the seaon goes on. So the dropoff from losing JK will be balanced by the improvement of Bunkley, Patterson, ect. Walker also looks strong and should benefit from the rotation-he's still a real nice inside rush DT.

        Finally, the wildcard is Ramsey. This kid is so athliteic you could play him at LDE on certain run downs. He is a stud IMO. I love this kid's potential-he's more athletic than even Bunkley or Patterson in terms of how he moves!

        So I see a loss of flexibility in terms of the packages JJ can run, but no steep drop off in pressure with a Howard, Cole, McDougle, Thomas rotation at DE. If it was me, I'd think about using Trotter in the Joker role in the nickle, as he is strong enough to take on the OL and still quick enough to make a few plays. Not ideal, but you want Barber in coverage. Don't laugh, but Ramsey runs well enough to maybe play some of the standup rush stuff. You heard it here first if it happens. My best guess is they would use Jason Short at Joker--he got time at DE this summer, and he moves well for a 260 lbs guy.
        I'm in total agreement and I love Ramsey playing some DE in a pinch.

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        • #5
          On the Homepage JJ was saying that basiclly nothing changes.McDougle starts at LDE along with Patterson,Walker,& Howard.When the "B" team(which IMO is better than most teams starters) he'll go with Cole,Bunkley,Rayburn,& Thomas.Kearse is out,McDougle's in and not to make light out of the situation,we should be "fine there".
          My concern is the secondary with Lito & Hood dinged up.JJ will have to be more conservative with his safeties to help out Wynn & Hansen.Brown's able to "man up" but Antonio Bryant could give him problems.
          The key here as it has been,is the push up front by the DL and I honestly don't see that much of a dropoff.
          Win the next two games,get Lito & Hood back,and we're okay.In the interim if you're gonna IR Kearse get Strickland on the practice field tomorrow.
          Just give me ONE before I go!

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          • #6
            j-bird, in that article you're talking about, there is this line:

            Johnson said that McDougle will not be the starter, he wants to talk to all of the players before naming one, but knows this is the opportunity that McDougle's been waiting for.
            So, we won't be seeing McDougle starting at LDE, but I'm sure we'll see plenty of him.

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            • #7
              I'm inclined to agree that Cole should stay where he is: He's a wrecking ball over there right now. So the two best options, as I see them, are either start McDougle or switch Howard to LDE. The question is how much you want to keep the full-line rotation. You could argue that Cole is what made that rotation work: With him in there you had a great 1st line and a good 2nd line. Move Cole to the 1st line and now you have a very good 1st line and a mediocre 2nd line. Now suddenly switching out all four guys at once might become a liability. This isn't necessarily a problem - we can still rotate guys in, just not in waves.

              On the other hand, with McDougle starting and Cole still leading the unchanged 2nd line, you've got a good 1st line and a good 2nd. Very little dropoff between the two. In fact, you've got a nice run/pass platoon there.

              So which option is better? I'm not sure. I could go with either, really. The 2-line rotation has worked thus far better than anyone imagined. But at the same time, there's something to be said for having your four best linemen on the field together, and that means Howard and Cole at DE. Either way we're in as good a shape as you can be after losing a player of Kearse's caliber.

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              • #8
                I disagree with your assessment of McDougle. He has NOT shown any explosion off the ball. He is slow off the ball. He is also easily blocked. I have actually seen much more flash from Thomas than I have from McDougle. So, I am hoping that they keep the two-line rotation in place - with Thomas playing with the first-string, and McDougle on the #2. If it ends up that McDougle plays better than Thomas, I'll concede that I was wrong. But, from what I have seen thus far, Thomas > McDougle.
                "Nobody in football should be called a genius. A genius is a guy like Norman Einstein." - Joe Theismann



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                • #9
                  JRJ, I always love your analysis, and I agree that McDougal should play LDE, but to say that we won't miss a beat is just thinking with your heart. McDougal has been inactive for a reason. Right now he is not as good as J. Thomas. To say that he'll replace Kearse from the standpoint of generating pressure is a big reach. Birds are in decent shape to have a former #1 who knows the system plugging the hole, but it's a giant hole and McDougal hasn't shown an ability to stay healthy or to play welll in his limited healthy periods. That said, maybe he needed a consistent opportunity and will develop. Funny to say that about a 4th year pro, but since he really hasn't played, there should be some development and hence upside. Good news is that he is playing for a contract, so maybe he steps up, we re-sign him, and have ridiculous depth next year with a healthy Freak and a proven McDougal.

                  I am very very proud to have moved up to 2nd string from that unmentionable status ... thanks!
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                  Robert Earle Clarke's response: Can you imagine vodka without alcohol?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by stocknowledge
                    But, from what I have seen thus far, Thomas > McDougle.
                    Exactly. People pull for McDougle i think because they don't want him to be a bust. I LOVE the way Thomas plays, i love his energy and determination. I hope he shines this season.

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                    • #11
                      Hey, reasonable minds can disagree.

                      I'm basic my views of Mac on what I saw of the live shots from training camp. Before he got hurt, he was as quick off the ball as any of the DE's, including Kearse and Cole.

                      Mac has never seen the field long enough (yes that IS the real problem with him) to get a full read on whether he can be a player or is a bust.

                      I think I see why the Birds drafted him. He has shorter arms which isn't good, but when he handfights to keep tackles off him, and gets a good jump off the snap, I'm telling you he can turn the corner and take the edge against 90% of the RT's in the NFL. He was abusing Runyan earlier in camp this year.

                      Read the quotes by the players and coaches about how McDougle flashed. I'm telling you for his size he plays with nice leverage, is a nice run defender (important for a LDE), and if he is fresh and not dinged (yes IF), he is a real nice pass rusher. I base it on potential, true, but coaches will tell you if a guy "flashes" what he can do as an upside, that is when you know if he can play in the NFL.

                      Recall the Minnesota game I cited. Did you see him fly upfield all game long? He HAS the skills. Unlike true busts like Jon Harris, who I knew couldn't play from day 1 and who flashed nothing ever, Mac has shown he CAN.

                      So I'll be the whipping boy if I'm wrong, but he may even get a sack this week right out of the gate.

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                      • #12
                        I've been in a cave so far this week. Did the Birds announce the new rotation?
                        Carson Wentz ERA


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                        • #13
                          No, BP, not as of yet.

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                          • #14
                            Last I heard,, maybe I'm wrong , but I thought the were flip flopping Howard into Kearses spot at LDE? No? and Cole was gonna start at RDE?

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by MDFAN
                              Last I heard,, maybe I'm wrong , but I thought the were flip flopping Howard into Kearses spot at LDE? No? and Cole was gonna start at RDE?
                              That's what I've heard too MD. I hope this is only temporary until McDougle gets into game shape. I think Cole is perfect where he at coming against a tired OT.
                              Whatcha Gonna Do Brother, When the Eagles run wild on you?

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