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A few thoughts on the Wentz contract-BGN

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  • A few thoughts on the Wentz contract-BGN

    There's a real good point here in the last sentence:


    By Dave Zangaro April 05, 2019 12:45 PM
    4 Comments
    It’s a gloomy Friday in Philly, but I’m trying to have a little fun.

    I asked you guys for some questions on Twitter and asked that they be fun ones. Some of you obliged. As always, thank you.

    Here’s the first bunch:


    Dave Zangaro

    @DZangaroNBCS
    · Apr 5, 2019
    How about an #Eagles mailbag today? Shoot over your questions, but let's make them fun ones for a Friday/weekend.


    Zack
    @ZackdelEagles
    Realistic Carson Wentz contract extension. __ years, ____ mil, _____ guarenteed

    Here’s what I came up with: 5 years, $159 million, $100 million guaranteed, $45 million signing bonus.

    Now, I’ll show my work. This contract would give Wentz an APY of $31.8 million, the second-highest APY in the league behind Aaron Rodgers ($33.5M) and ahead of Matt Ryan ($30M). I think there’s a chance the signing bonus is slightly lower to allow for an option bonus somewhere in that contract. The Eagles have used team options a lot in recent contracts and it might not be a terrible idea to have a kill switch on this deal, especially considering Wentz’s injury history.

    Here’s a look at Rodgers’ and Ryan’s most recent deals:

    Rodgers: 4-year extension, $134M, $98.2M guaranteed, $57M signing bonus

    Ryan: 5-year extension, $150M, $100M guaranteed, $46.5M signing bonus

    Either way, he’s going to be in that ballpark with Rodgers and Ryan. You can argue Wentz doesn’t deserve to be based on his body of work, but he’s going to get paid a huge sum of money and the salary cap rises each year. The current CBA is also scheduled to run out after the 2020 season, which could change everything and even possibly lead to an uncapped 2021.

    I know some folks have wondered if Wentz will take some sort of hometown discount like Tom Brady has for years. It’s just unfair to ask him to do that and would really be frowned upon by the NFLPA. When these kinds of deals are made, they set the market for other players. If the Seahawks redo Russell Wilson’s deal before Wentz, it could potentially reset the market again.
    "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

  • #2
    If that’s the money then I’m out guys. Draft a QB in the first round this year that you like and move on. I know that sounds drastic but I cannot see a way to win consistently paying one guy a 1/6 of your salary cap.

    Again I get it that sounds drastic but I can’t do it especially based on his injury history and the obvious flaws in his game. He is good to very good but Wentz is not Pat Mahommes who is a freakish athlete. This sort of money would be a real wing and a prayer type of deal.

    If he won’t taje a bit less to help build around him then move him.
    You know Darren if you'd have told me 10 years ago that someday I was going to solve the world's energy problems I'd have said your crazy.... now lets drop this big ball of oil out the window.

    Comment


    • #3
      Just to throw this out there...

      Nick Foles signed for 4 years 88 mil, 50 mil guaranteed. I'm still not sure I wouldn't take Nick at this rate, and the additional player salaries that could be had given the difference, if Wentz is going to get 5 years 160 and 100 mil guaranteed. That's a hell of a lot of money to work with, and it's a team sport.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Eaglebreath View Post
        Just to throw this out there...

        Nick Foles signed for 4 years 88 mil, 50 mil guaranteed. I'm still not sure I wouldn't take Nick at this rate, and the additional player salaries that could be had given the difference, if Wentz is going to get 5 years 160 and 100 mil guaranteed. That's a hell of a lot of money to work with, and it's a team sport.
        I trust the Howie and Carson to find a way to make it work. The Patriots and Brady have cheated their way around this for years now.

        I'm 100% positive that Kraft is depositing money into off shore accounts under the name Randall Stevens.
        Canada's #1 Eagles fan.

        Comment


        • #5
          I think that you guys are nuts but I guess that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Look how long Cleveland and Buffalo have looked for quarterbacks. Do you want to draft a Borttles or Tanehill for 5 years until you realize that they suck and you are still in QB Hell???? You have to face it fellas, that is the price of doing business in the NFL these days. It's only going up from here. !! He's one of the top 5 and you want to get rid of him? Watch what happens to Nick down there in Jacksonville. We've seen that show before. I'm finding this conversation hard to believe. I say sign him now before these contracts go through the roof when legal gambling is allowed and salary caps zoom with the next bargaining with the league. Then you will have plenty of money to sign whoever else you want. I can't believe my ears hear.
          "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

          Comment


          • #6
            The cap will keep going up, presumably.

            Also... right now, Wentz is in his last rookie year, and we have the fifth year option, and we'd certainly use the franchise tag on him. Those would all be less than the predicted contract year values -- so if we sign him now, some of those dollars would have to be priced in, perhaps making the annual average lower. The Eagles could tack a couple very high dollar final years on a contract to increase the APY to get above Ryan, possibly, without really affecting the current values. The cap hits in earlier years would most likely be below (and possibly well below) 30 million. I don't think there is any problem coming in below Rodgers' deal, but the Ryan deal did reset the market some.

            Additionally, we have been paying a fair amount for our QBs on the cap already. The deal would probably be an additional 10-15 million of cap that we are not spending on QBs, so you would have to find that somewhere, along with always having cheap rookie (or vet-minimum) backup QBs. That is difficult but not necessarily devastating.

            If we are lucky, Wentz will eventually take the approach of Brady, of adjusting his deals so that he's generally in the top 10 list, but without feeling the need to be at the top. But I think this first deal will probably need to be substantial. Whether it happens this season or next, not sure.

            Comment


            • #7
              It is a lot of cash but I'm not sure people if people are shopping in the lot of cash area of the store or if they think there is a bargain area. Did anyone not just see numbers like 330 million and 400 plus million just thrown out.
              You can keep paying the Chase Daniels of the world or you can go all in. I don't know if Wentz will be all world or not. Personally, both Wilson and Mahomes are quality QBs but I'm not putting either in the all world category on their own. Much like Rodgers, without a quality supporting cast they can't do it alone. Wentz is the same way. I think we forget watching some of the AMAZING s*** he did his first year.
              I was and am a believer in Nick but the birds went all in on Wentz and I am with them. Can't run scared that he will get injured. If that is the case you better move on and live in mediocrity until you luck into another franchise level QB
              Wait until next year is a terrible philosophy
              Hope is not a strategy
              RIP

              Comment


              • #8
                Stop using Brady as an example already. He's the only QB in the NFL who is married to someone who makes more money than he does. He takes less money because he would rather win, yes, but it's a lot easier to do that when you are married to a world famous supermodel.

                I'm not sold on Wentz as a top 5 QB for one simple reason. Injuries. He's been in the league for 3 seasons. The last two of which he suffered season ending injuries that shut him down. You hand him that kind of contract and he continues to miss games like he has so far, and you will doom the franchise to the basement. While I generally agree with getting this kind of deal done as soon as you can, before the market increases, I really want to see Wentz play a full season before I hand him a 150 million dollar contract.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Eaglebreath View Post
                  Stop using Brady as an example already. He's the only QB in the NFL who is married to someone who makes more money than he does. He takes less money because he would rather win, yes, but it's a lot easier to do that when you are married to a world famous supermodel.

                  I'm not sold on Wentz as a top 5 QB for one simple reason. Injuries. He's been in the league for 3 seasons. The last two of which he suffered season ending injuries that shut him down. You hand him that kind of contract and he continues to miss games like he has so far, and you will doom the franchise to the basement. While I generally agree with getting this kind of deal done as soon as you can, before the market increases, I really want to see Wentz play a full season before I hand him a 150 million dollar contract.
                  Fair enough, I'll wait to see how durable. But you guys that are just afraid of the pricetag are going to have to realize that the price of poker has gone up. And EB, Brady took less money long before his wife was in the picture and Carr did too FWIW so their teams could prosper. Either way you have to pay for talent so it doesn't matter. There's always a way to find the money..
                  "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Eagle60 View Post
                    Fair enough, I'll wait to see how durable. But you guys that are just afraid of the pricetag are going to have to realize that the price of poker has gone up. And EB, Brady took less money long before his wife was in the picture and Carr did too FWIW so their teams could prosper. Either way you have to pay for talent so it doesn't matter. There's always a way to find the money..
                    Tell that to Detroit and Baltimore. Two teams that gave franchise QB money to guys that didn't play like it.

                    I have no doubts about Wentz's ability to play at a very high level. I understand the economics involved. I also agree that you can't play these financial games scared. But, if you are going to hand someone a 150 million dollar contract, they better damned sight earn it on the field. If they don't, you're fucked. Period.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Eaglebreath View Post
                      Tell that to Detroit and Baltimore. Two teams that gave franchise QB money to guys that didn't play like it.

                      I have no doubts about Wentz's ability to play at a very high level. I understand the economics involved. I also agree that you can't play these financial games scared. But, if you are going to hand someone a 150 million dollar contract, they better damned sight earn it on the field. If they don't, you're fucked. Period.
                      I think that Stafford is still a quality QB. Flacco was too for a long time and he's starting again in Denver. Their salaries look cheap now don't they? You can't fight the salaries EB. Hell, look at Trout's paycheck. It ain't my money so I really don't give a shit. The Eagles are now worth $3.8 billion by the last estimate and I'm going to worry?
                      "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The eagles value for the franchise is nice for Laurie but this league has a salary cap. Overweighting your roster in one position can be devastating if it is a mistake.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          He played all 16 games his rookie year. When he's healthy he's a top 5 QB. Aaron Rodgers has been hurt quite a bit an nobody will blink at his contract. The market for Nick was lukewarm. Put Wentz on the market and his salary would break a world record. You guys are being silly. You honestly want to trade him and go with a kid?
                          "Hey Giants, who's your Daddy?"

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Eagle60 View Post
                            He played all 16 games his rookie year. When he's healthy he's a top 5 QB. Aaron Rodgers has been hurt quite a bit an nobody will blink at his contract. The market for Nick was lukewarm. Put Wentz on the market and his salary would break a world record. You guys are being silly. You honestly want to trade him and go with a kid?
                            We trade Wentz or let him walk, we’ll see QB hell for years to come.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Eagle60 View Post
                              He played all 16 games his rookie year. When he's healthy he's a top 5 QB. Aaron Rodgers has been hurt quite a bit an nobody will blink at his contract. The market for Nick was lukewarm. Put Wentz on the market and his salary would break a world record. You guys are being silly. You honestly want to trade him and go with a kid?
                              I certainly don't want to trade him, or let him walk. That's not what I'm saying at all.

                              All I am saying is that I am not so sure that I wouldn't rather have Nick Foles and the contract he signed in Jacksonville, plus the draft picks they could have gotten for Wentz, plus the difference in dollars between what Nick got, and what Wentz will surely get, to pay for additional talent on the roster. Like I said, it's a team sport.

                              That said, the Eagles made their decision. They know they're going to have to pay Wentz what the market dictates, and they will do that. I just hope for our sake that they made the correct decision.

                              Comment

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